Does Publish Mean Success?

I have a serious question for the writers here. I'm an avid reader of poetry, fiction and some other stuff but what I've found recently is that the idea of success is defined by whether or not you're published?

Does being publish mean you are successful?

I've always dreamed of being published, and it is still certainly my goal. However with all the crap that is being published I'm not sure I want my word next to something that 'I' don't believe the writer spent enough time on. The point of these forums is not to tell others they suck, it is to help others get better and encourage them to do so. Another thing is people who are published are always throwing their supposed 'success' up in other yet to be publish writer's faces. I don't much care for that.

Just because 'she' (this is strictly hypothetical) published 3 books of 200 poems doesn't means she's the best, nor does it mean she is a success as a poet.

Is it just me who feels that success is defined by the person him/herself?
Is it defined by the world's standards? Who is exactly responsible for determining levels of success?

Well, before I ever saw any of my words in print, I would have said that yes being published = success. Now .... not so much. Success, in my opinion, means really liking the person in the mirror whether or not someone has published their work.

I agree with Rumpole.

Success doesn't have to do with whether you are published or not. You can publish a book, but that doesn't mean that you are successful, because what if nobody buys it? Then you are just a writer with a published book. So what? That isn't success in my eyes!

If you can read your work and you think it is great, this is success in my opinion. When you are happy with what you've accomplished, then you are successful. While publishing a book just makes you popular successful.

The idea behind holding up publishing history as a display of success is that the author's work was seen worthy and acceptable by someone in a position of power and an authority on literature. And in fairness it is a great accomplishment, but it doesn't mean success.

The simple and harsh truth is most books by first time authors don't sell. They end up on the discount rack at the local bookstore or are sent back to the publishing company and the author is never heard from again. So, really what we as a community should be asking anyone holding themselves up a success because they've been published is, how where your sales figures and were you asked to sign a second book deal?

Personally, I'm sort of middle of the road on this question. I write because I love to write. If I didn't love it I would find some other career path. On the other hand I'm realistic. If no one wants to read my work or buy my work then what is it worth beyond personal amusement? And if all I was aiming for was personal amusement I wouldn't be here and I wouldn't be seeking ways to improve my craft and make it more marketable I just keep it all to myself.

Success for me will be knowing my books are popular. Publishing is just a milestone to reach- although a big one. I want to prove to myself I'm good at this writing thing.

As someone who has been published, let me say that publishing has its own scale of success/failure. Getting published is a milestone, but it is like saying 'being paid makes you a professional.' When you are paid for doing something, then you are placed on a ladder of successful professional or lackey. When you become published, you are placed on a ladder of popular writer or shelf filler.

I have said it elsewhere, I don't like the books in the bookstore. I thus don't really want to become a best-selling author, because then I will be in the bookstore, and I could end up not liking myself or what I am writing. However, I feel for my readers and would like them to have more credibility. I thus do things to try and advance my worth, and maybe one day things will finally hit. Hopefully, I will also retain my dignity.

You know, a few years back I may have agreed that published means success but now I don't. Not because I've published anything, far from it honestly. It's just that "being published" has a whole new meaning these days with online and self publishing.

Anyone can publish their manuscripts online and order them for friends or the local book store. Does that mean success? For some people yes, which is great.

For me, success is when people purchase my works not because they know me, but because they don't and they want to.

deathbypen wrote:

For me, success is when people purchase my works not because they know me, but because they don't and they want to.

Oh honey, I hear this same sentiment repeated all the time about self-publishing and it couldn't be further from the reality of things. The vast majority of the people I know who have self-published have sold almost exclusively to people who don't know them, but either want to or just think the book's subject/story sounds cool. People who know you will expect you to comp them a book for free, because they DO know you, rather you self-publish or get published the traditional way... Oh, and you'll be expected to write a few nice words about how much they mean to you and sign it as well.

HYdraMStar wrote:

deathbypen wrote:

For me, success is when people purchase my works not because they know me, but because they don't and they want to.

Oh honey, I hear this same sentiment repeated all the time about self-publishing and it couldn't be further from the reality of things. The vast majority of the people I know who have self-published have sold almost exclusively to people who don't know them, but either want to or just think the book's subject/story sounds cool. People who know you will expect you to comp them a book for free, because they DO know you, rather you self-publish or get published the traditional way... Oh, and you'll be expected to write a few nice words about how much they mean to you and sign it as well.

Let me agree with HYdraMStar. I have sold a number of books to those that don't know me, but I get them to feel that they would want to. I am proud that they purchased my books. I am proud of my books. I know others that are proud of me for writing the books, for getting them published (however I did it), and then for being able to sell some. I can claim to have made a rung or two on the ladder of publishing success, but it is a tall ladder and the rungs that I climbed are very much on the bottom of the ladder. I have not jumped off however, and that I believe still makes me a viable contender.

Well, I guess that's just from my limited experience. I've talked to only a couple folks who self-published. Once in person, and I even purchased his book only to find it littered with mistakes, and written so poorly that I had to force myself to finish it. I read it because he was a friend of a friend but it sort of redefined what self-publishing success is in my eyes.

I guess I need to read more.

deathbypen wrote:

Well, I guess that's just from my limited experience. I've talked to only a couple folks who self-published. Once in person, and I even purchased his book only to find it littered with mistakes, and written so poorly that I had to force myself to finish it. I read it because he was a friend of a friend but it sort of redefined what self-publishing success is in my eyes.

I guess I need to read more.

Oh, I can agree that there ARE a lot of bad books out there. I read independent books as well. When I went to conventions to sell my books, I bought the books of the other authors attempting the same thing I was. I also am on sites such as this where I read the stuff of author-wannabes. The MAJORITY are things simply poorly edited. I read a lot of potentially good stuff just not given the tender loving care of careful repeated editings. I do give myself a pat on the back for having texts with few mistakes (I am willing to go one-to-one with any book on the shelves of a bookstore).

Where I enjoy independent books however is in the break from the banality of mass published texts. I enjoy a floating PoV, where the scenes are crafted more like a movie camera on a boom than having a view like that of a shoot-em-up computer game. I enjoy the diversity of finding writers with different visions who have not yet been locked into the dry stale presentation of the mass publishers.

The major problem is that most are not as driven to continue writing as I am. When I find a good book, that author has done no more. On sites like this, I am often waiting weeks to months for the next installment. I thus find myself wandering into bookstores to fill in the time between having stuff to read. After slamming those books against a wall however, I return to writing or find myself glad for the next chance to read something off-market. Still, I try to find those fresh voices out there and give them some support, because they deserve it.

I think you hit the nail on the head. I'm sure with a few more edits, my friend's friend would have had a beauiful manuscript, but it simply fell short.

Editing usually is the one aspect that gets neglected the most.

Now, I'd love to craft an arguement defending mass publishers from the independent author, but I admit to really having one side of the story. As stated before, I haven't had good experiences with independent authors, but that lack of experience shouldn't over shadow the talented ones. On that note, what are some good sites? How do you learn about conventions?

deathbypen wrote:

On that note, what are some good sites? How do you learn about conventions?

Both of you questions are easily answered by the standard phrases: Yahoo or Google (or other search engine). Don't go to Amazon or such, as they push the major authors. Once you find a book however, checking on them (ISBN) through Amazon or such can sometimes give you the better price.

I tend to look for novels over 250 pages (about 80,000 words or more). It takes some dedication to write long works, so the quality tends to increase. You can also get some tedious works of really bad quality, but in my opinion I get the same thing at the bookstore anyway. Note that after reading, I tend to post a review on the website that I found it as well as send the author a review as I believe that any advice and publicity is good.